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Dirtdealer
Joined: 25 Oct 2009 Posts: 13
1988 TransAm GTA Firebird
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Posted: Wed Mar 20, 2019 12:30 pm Post subject: 88 GTA Missing problem |
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Having a heck of a time figuring this out, just started on 3/18/19 it stalled and wouldn't start thought it was out of gas even though the gauge said almost a quarter of a tank. Put in good gas and put drove it back in the garage. Started it later and is running very rough, no service engine soon light or anything to reference.
I cleaned the Mass air flow sensor and looks really clean, cleaned it twice to be sure. Didn't help.
Put in a new air filter not any help.
If I run it for a long period or time say 20 minutes or so it gets better but not perfect.
I noticed a few burnt pieces on the ground sort of like pieces of burnt rice and small pebbles?
Catalytic Converter? It was supposedly changed a few year ago on a mis- diagnosis of the MAS but that's another story.
Slight odor which if I remember right my last Cat converter smelled before it went out.
But no check engine!
Put in injector cleaner but not any noticeable difference.
It is an 88 Transam GTA 5 liter with just under 8,000 miles on it. Any hell would be appreciated.
Last edited by Dirtdealer on Thu Mar 21, 2019 9:48 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Larry Site Admin
Joined: 01 Jun 2006 Posts: 4774
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Posted: Wed Mar 20, 2019 2:33 pm Post subject: Trans Am Problems |
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This is a bit newer that what I'm used to, but your comment about an odor seems to indicate a cat converter. They can smell like rotten eggs (sulfur).
However, with just 8k miles, how could anything be bad? I don't know what they can do... break down from age...? I do know that a restricted exhaust can cause some really goofy problems.
Where did these burnt pieces show up (at the tail pipe)? _________________ PontiacRegistry.com... building the single largest source of Pontiac information, services, and entertainment in the world! |
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Dirtdealer
Joined: 25 Oct 2009 Posts: 13
1988 TransAm GTA Firebird
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Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:59 pm Post subject: |
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Yes, the burnt pieces came out of the tail pipe took them to a muffler shop and they said just pieces of the pipe from age.
Went to a mechanic I trust and he said the same thing and that it could be an injector or water in the gas even using Stabil. So I had already added injector cleaner to the gas and put in some high octane gas along with more Stabil. Running better will take it around the block tomorrow I just don't like putting more miles on it.
Will let you know. |
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Larry Site Admin
Joined: 01 Jun 2006 Posts: 4774
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Posted: Sun Mar 24, 2019 8:52 am Post subject: Running Poorly |
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If there is any suspicion of water in the gas, I don't think Stabil will help that. Get a couple cans of "Heat" and pour it in. That stuff will "absorb" the water and pass it through. It works wonders getting rid of moisture. It is used up north in the winter to prevent freezing of water that might be in the tank. _________________ PontiacRegistry.com... building the single largest source of Pontiac information, services, and entertainment in the world! |
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Dirtdealer
Joined: 25 Oct 2009 Posts: 13
1988 TransAm GTA Firebird
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Posted: Sun Mar 24, 2019 12:08 pm Post subject: |
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I will get some and give it a shot,
thanks for the info |
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Dirtdealer
Joined: 25 Oct 2009 Posts: 13
1988 TransAm GTA Firebird
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Posted: Thu Mar 28, 2019 5:31 pm Post subject: |
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Put the Heet in and drove a little, trying to keep the miles down, and ran it for quite a while in the garage. The majority of the missing seems to be gone but now when it is first started in the am it runs pretty rough at idle. Not when it has higher RPMS but once it is warm runs really well. Now I think I have a vacuum leak somewhere.
Thanks for the help any suggestions on the most common place for leaks?
Larry |
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Larry Site Admin
Joined: 01 Jun 2006 Posts: 4774
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Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 10:31 am Post subject: Rough Idle |
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Before going nutz looking for a vacuum leak, put a vacuum gauge on it to see if it is holding vacuum or not, or bouncing around. Have you tried cleaning the throttle body? Even what looks like only a little carbon (black) around the inside can keep the throttle plate from closing properly and cause a rough idle. My F150 and Dakota both required periodic cleaning... I could always tell when by the beginning of a rougher idle. It's worth a try.
But, even so, bad gas, moisture, etc. can take quite a while to completely go away. Sounds like you're on the right track though. Rarely are these problems catastrophic; usually a combination of little ones. _________________ PontiacRegistry.com... building the single largest source of Pontiac information, services, and entertainment in the world! |
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Dirtdealer
Joined: 25 Oct 2009 Posts: 13
1988 TransAm GTA Firebird
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Posted: Fri Mar 29, 2019 2:51 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for the good info will check it out and let you know how it goes, might be a while though before I get back to you guess I will get rid of the gas that's in it and go from there. |
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Dirtdealer
Joined: 25 Oct 2009 Posts: 13
1988 TransAm GTA Firebird
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Posted: Tue Apr 16, 2019 5:46 pm Post subject: 88 GTA Missing problem |
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OK finally got rid of the old fuel and only have good stuff in now.
In doing the vacuum test it is a consistent 17 pounds when it is just
started and when it's warmed up.
Isn't it suppose to be a little higher? Not sure myself and can't find info
relating to the proper amount.
Also, checked the throttle body and it appears to be clean so at a dead end.
Any other suggestions before I punt and take it to a mechanic?
Thanks for the help |
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Larry Site Admin
Joined: 01 Jun 2006 Posts: 4774
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Posted: Wed Apr 17, 2019 9:34 am Post subject: Rough Idle |
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You mention cleaning the mass air flow sensor with no better results. Perhaps replacing it would be as good idea. I know you have very low miles on the car, but that alone does not make for no problems. My wife's '03 (bought in the summer of '02) Tiburon GT has under 30k miles, and it has had issues I don't think a well used car would have. Using the car actually helps it.
Check this article: https://www.yourmechanic.com/article/symptoms-of-a-bad-or-failing-mass-airflow-sensor
"Symptoms of a Bad or Failing Mass Airflow Sensor
Common signs of problems with a mass airflow sensor include running rich at idle or lean under load, decrease in fuel efficiency, and rough idles..."
It can't be a very expensive item, and easily changed. It kind of is the thing that tells the car's brain what to do.
The '74 T/A 400 in my '40 Pontiac idles at a steady 15-16 lbs. at idle. That is well in the "Good" range, so you're fine at 17. _________________ PontiacRegistry.com... building the single largest source of Pontiac information, services, and entertainment in the world! |
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Dirtdealer
Joined: 25 Oct 2009 Posts: 13
1988 TransAm GTA Firebird
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Posted: Wed Apr 17, 2019 10:45 am Post subject: 88 GTA Missing problem |
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I thought about replacing the Mass Air Flow Sensor, again but it looks so clean I hate to do it just to see if that's the issue and they are pretty expensive, Least expensive I could find is $140 and that ism't a factory one. They are more at the dealer.
I did run better when I cleaned it and got rid of the bad gas. Will try cleaning it once more since the symptoms it has are the same as you described.
Then go from there.
Even if I were to replace it they are not very well made, I went through 2 factory replacements and a knock off before I got one that works.
Thanks |
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Larry Site Admin
Joined: 01 Jun 2006 Posts: 4774
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Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 10:10 am Post subject: Mass Air Flow Sensor |
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I didn't realize you had changed the MAF sensor before. I guess trying to clean again wouldn't hurt. They mention special solvents or alcohol as the best.
If you clean again, and it runs better, that might indicate something.
Have you ever put a diagnostic reader on your car? Perhaps the over-the-counter ones aren't sensitive enough, but did you mechanic "scope it ?"
On another thought, a number of years ago I got some watered down gas in my Dakota (hardly made it home after filing up) and it took many miles after siphoning out as much gas as I could, refilling with premium gas, a FEW bottles of Heet, and repeat about two more times before it ran well again. Then I had to still take it to the garage to have the computer reset. Only then did it actually run like before again.
BTW, that was BP gas and they would NOT even respond to my many requests for compensation of about $150.00 in repairs and the 20 gals. of replacement gas. So I chopped my BP credit card into pieces, stapled the pieces to a letter to them, and have never bought another penny of BP gas again. _________________ PontiacRegistry.com... building the single largest source of Pontiac information, services, and entertainment in the world! |
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Dirtdealer
Joined: 25 Oct 2009 Posts: 13
1988 TransAm GTA Firebird
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Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 12:49 pm Post subject: 88 GTA Missing problem |
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OK, here is the latest: I cleaned the Mass Air Flow Sensor again and it ran OK for maybe 30 seconds and then back to the same issues. so I still have old sensor I cleaned it and put it on, same response, same problem.
When the Chevy dealer replaced the original MAS we went through 2 GM sensors that didn't work before I bought a after market one that worked until recently. Not sure if it's the problem or not. Anyway, Do I have 2 bad mass air flow sensors? Don't know so I guess I will take it to the mechanic and see what he has to say and if he might have a clue.
At least he will be able to run a scan and see if there is a code I am not getting.
Will let you know when I know.
Thanks for the advice, |
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Larry Site Admin
Joined: 01 Jun 2006 Posts: 4774
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Posted: Thu Apr 18, 2019 3:15 pm Post subject: MAF |
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Without having any knowledge of how the car computers work (it's magic!), it sure sounds like after you remove and clean the MAF sensor maybe the computer "thinks" all is fine, and then it goes back to some previous condition. Does that mean the car computer needs resetting..? I don't know, but running fine and then going right back to bad- with no time for an actual "condition" to develop, sure sounds like a computer issue. Maybe reading some phony problem, or old one that is actually not really there any longer. Kind of like having to clear out the cashe in your computer at home periodically to keep it from going back to bad or no longer existing places.
Please keep us posted. And good luck. _________________ PontiacRegistry.com... building the single largest source of Pontiac information, services, and entertainment in the world! |
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Dirtdealer
Joined: 25 Oct 2009 Posts: 13
1988 TransAm GTA Firebird
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Posted: Sat May 04, 2019 7:12 pm Post subject: 88 GTA Missing problem |
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OK got the car back from a mechanic I trust and no codes indicating anything wrong, said it is probably the sparks plugs have developed a coating on them because the car hasn't been driven enough. Suggested I drive it more or change the plugs. Hasn't been that long since they have been changed so if it doesn't clear up soon I will change them out. So far I have put on an extra 41 miles and the same issue until it warms up.
Never happened before so still not sure but it does not affect it once it warms up.
Ever hear of this?
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