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Well, finally got off my @#$ and have started on the Lemans
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russosborne



Joined: 02 Jan 2011
Posts: 117
Location: Warren Ohio USA

1970 Lemans

PostPosted: Mon Oct 10, 2011 6:46 pm    Post subject: Well, finally got off my @#$ and have started on the Lemans Reply with quote

Got tired of being too tired, and just went out and started. Got the hood, fenders, doors, and back seat off Friday night/saturday. Got the car into the garage(don't buy HF dollies) finally on Sunday. Then got the front seat, all belts, and all carpet out. Steering column is next, followed by the dash itself.

Found a few surprises. Like rust holes at the bottom of both outer corners of the firewall/cowl. Couldn't see it with the fenders and doors on.
The trunk pan had been fiberglassed on both outer sides. It was a well done job, I didn't even realise that it wasn't metal. But the pan is rusted completely along the trunk supports, and the supports are shot too. Ok, I was planning on doing the trunk anyway.
One thing I wasn't planning on doing was the panel between the trunk lid and the rear window. Top looked great, but the panel on the inside of the trunk area is gone.

Also found a patch job on the passenger floor at the toe board. Nice orange sheet metal. Rolling Eyes But that was pretty much it for at least obvious rust on the floors. The drivers side may need replaced, didn't feel like checking it out, but there is a lot of surface rust on the inside at least.

Will add pictures later from home, am at work now and don't have any with me.

Oh, guess I should add my plans. I am pretty sure I am pulling the body off. Found this cool "rolltissorie" on a hot rod forum. Made out of wood, and it lets you get the bottom of the car upright. As far as I am tearing the car down just to replace stuff like seats, dash, column, front sheet metal, etc, as I am I decided that pulling the body won't be that much more work. Plus it will make it tons easier for me. I am not loving crawling under cars as much as I used to. Surprised

Russ
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Larry
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Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Posts: 4768




PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2011 11:44 am    Post subject: Got to Work Reply with quote

Hi Russ,

You're an encouragement for all of who have been procrastinating. Now that the Florida million-degree summer is over, I have promised to get back to work on the '69 Custom S wagon project. Worked on it last Fall after YEARS of nothing, then crapped out when it started geting dark in winter months- VERY poor excuse for living in Florida-- and that's what all the lights and stands in the shed are for! No more excuses this year. I SO miss driving one of my old cars.

First project is to build a new fuel cell rack in the rear. When you live in Florida, you try to keep the welding projects for the winter.

Keep us posted.
Larry

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russosborne



Joined: 02 Jan 2011
Posts: 117
Location: Warren Ohio USA

1970 Lemans

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2011 3:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is going to be one interesting car. Very Happy

I spent most of my older childhood and all my adult years up until 6 years ago in Phoenix. I understand about waiting for winter. Laughing
I am still trying to adjust to Ohio weather. Even though I was born here and lived here until I was 10, being an adult in this snow stuff is a lot different. Fortunately my wife gets my car thing, so she understood why I insisted on buying a house with at least a 2 car garage. I had to do an emergency repair on my dd a few years ago in the middle of a snow storm. Never againi. Exclamation

Did a little last night. Wanted to get the column off, but had a problem with the cotter pin that holds the shift linkage on the column. So I went to plan b. Just start taking stuff off. Got the heater blower box off the firewall, windshield and rear window stainless. Wiper motor and wipers. Couple of other really little things. Then just before I called it a night tried the cotter pin again, having used PB blaster on it earlier. Stupid thing came right out.

Found more rust. This was unexpected. The cowl is rusted along the bottom of the windshield. Mainly around the pass side wiper stud. But also on the driver's side where the seam is that joins the top and side piece. Both of these areas have holes. Crying or Very sad Looks like I will get really good at welding.
I'll try to remember to take the camera out with me tonight. Thought about going in and getting it last night, but I knew if I went in the house I wouldn't come back.

Good thing I already needed a new windshield. Cracked this one when I started to remove the first piece of stainless. Took my a little while to get the feel for it back.

Can you tell I like taking stuff apart? Laughing

Russ
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Larry
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2011 6:37 pm    Post subject: Work in Process Reply with quote

My wagon has been a work in process for many years. It has a fairly well built 400 also. Can't wait to get it back on the road... scares the hell out of the Mustang weinies! Beats 'em too.

If you get a small MIG, you can do a lot. Don't even need one with separate gas, just get one that uses fluxed wire.

The windshield fits from '68 through '70 at least, perhaps even more. Found that out the hard way too! Remember that little tool for removing the trim. It slides under the stainless and has a small hook-like thing that pulls back the clips. I can send a picture if you need to see but JC Witney has them.

While stationed at Wright-Patterson AFB '69-'73 pulled a 390 out of a friend's '66 Fairlane GT (like the one I had) out in the parking lot one night with a chain, along pipe, and a bunch of GIs. Next night swung in the new engine. It started to snow. By the time we were done, there was about 5" of snow. Thank goodness for the base hobby shop. Towed it there the next day (a Saturday) and drive it out by the afternoon.

Keep on keepin' on!
Larry

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russosborne



Joined: 02 Jan 2011
Posts: 117
Location: Warren Ohio USA

1970 Lemans

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2011 9:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Already have a mig, if it hasn't rusted apart from sitting for 5 years. It has been in a garage the whole time, so just need to replace the liner, which I will need to do for the gas.
Lincoln 100HD, I think. Been awhile since i looked at it. Embarassed
Bought a gas kit for it, just need to get a bottle of gas.

One thing I am not good at is practicing. Otherwise I would be a heavy metal bassist. Have that problem with the welding too. My practice learning is probably going to be when I start welding on the Lemans.

I should buy one of those tools. A screwdriver isn't really the best thing to use, but again there is that patience thing. Why wait til tomorrow for what I can screw up today. Twisted Evil

Russ
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russosborne



Joined: 02 Jan 2011
Posts: 117
Location: Warren Ohio USA

1970 Lemans

PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 8:45 pm    Post subject: pictures so far Reply with quote

here are a few of the more interesting ones. Crying or Very sad
I did get the column out last night, which is when I found the hole in the driver's side floor. Want to get the dash tonight, but feel like I am coming down with something. Sad Will have to see when I get home how I feel.
Russ
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russosborne



Joined: 02 Jan 2011
Posts: 117
Location: Warren Ohio USA

1970 Lemans

PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 8:50 pm    Post subject: a few more. Reply with quote

not sure how many are allowed to be posted in one post.
I have quite a few more, but don't think I have them here at work.
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Larry
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 8:51 pm    Post subject: '70 Lemans Project Reply with quote

The passenger side floor may not be "factory" but if it is welded in well... that's what they make carpet and mats for. Check underneath to see that it isn't too raggedty though.

For the driver's side, check with Classic-2-Current. They have good prices and lots of stuff. Click on "AFFILIATES' then "Member Discounts, and "Pontiac Parts.' They give our members a nice discount. Contact me for the codes to get into their dealer section when ordering, or call them direct.

Hope you don't get an early winter cold bug.

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russosborne



Joined: 02 Jan 2011
Posts: 117
Location: Warren Ohio USA

1970 Lemans

PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2011 9:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's a good point. Have to check out the welds, they are covered by rtv. Assuming that it is welded.

The sooner I am done getting it all apart the happier I will be. Tired of finding surprises every night. Shocked

Thanks, who knows what is going on with me. Probably just a result of working 45-55 hours a week for just about the whole year. Not as young as I used to be.

Russ
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russosborne



Joined: 02 Jan 2011
Posts: 117
Location: Warren Ohio USA

1970 Lemans

PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2011 3:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sigh. more progress, more rust.

Got the dash, brake bracket, ebrake, gas pedal off. Found another rust hole (pretty big) on the drivers side behind the kick panel, at the bottom. You can see the garage floor through this, think it is also in the cowl.

Also saw some more of the orange metal, so obviously someone has tried to fix this before, but looks like whoever did it didn't do anything to stop the rust as the hole I found is just past the repair.

Got a couple of pictures, the memory stick got full. Found out I had the smallest stick I own in the camera.

Also found something really interesting. On the backside of the glove box door there is a tire capacity sticker. No problem, except this clearly says "Tempest" on it. Starting to understand why some sites list the Tempest as being made in 1970 now.

Hope to get the rest of the firewall stuff off, heater, etc, tonight. After that it is just the headliner, rear interior upper panels (already have the plastic ones off), package tray,rear windows, windshield, and bumper and the car body will be ready to come off. Now to build a "rolltissorie". Will post a link to this one later. Made out of wood, one person can supposedly easily do it. It only turns the body 90 degrees, but that is plenty to do the floor.


Russ
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Larry
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2011 7:01 pm    Post subject: Rust Repair Reply with quote

Don't panic onthe rust repairs. If it isn't critical that it all look "factroy" when done-- like anyone will see it anyway?!

Just clean it all well, trim it out neatly, and do one part at a time. You can build off of a new patch to the next area. A patch doesn't have to be one magically shaped piece that covers everything in one shot. Use a good gauge of steel though. If you can chop some clean pieces out of some fenders or such, they are perfect.

I rebuilt a driver's floor in a '76 Chevy pickup that went from the side panel area to completely under the gas pedal and up the tunnel... not to mention from the fireway to nearly under the seat area. When done it was definately not factory, but very strong and pretty darn nice looking too.

Found lots of broken glass while working there. Obviously the window had been broken at one time and probably went for years without a new one. All the rest of the floor was solid. Must have filled up good with Florida rains.

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russosborne



Joined: 02 Jan 2011
Posts: 117
Location: Warren Ohio USA

1970 Lemans

PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2011 8:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not panicking. Much. Rolling Eyes

Just hoping there is enough good metal left to patch on. Ok, being a little over the top, the floor is really in good shape for an Ohio car. Problem is I am used to Arizona cars. Laughing

I am worried about the rear package tray area, since the piece behind the rear glass is totally gone on the bottom side. Hopefully will be better than I am expecting. Heck, if there is any metal left it will be better than I am expecting at this point. I am not sure, but I think I see wood under the speaker hole. Shocked Can't be too upset though, that is the sort of thing I would do in my younger and more broker days.

I could likely make my own patches for at least most of it. Complex curves might be a tad hard. I am used to having to make do, just was hoping that at 52 I was past that. Embarassed Actually though, the patch panels aren't that much if I just need the smaller ones, and I can get them thru Summit Racing with no shipping since I am only about an hour away from the Tallmadge store. I don't expect perfection, but do want it to look decent at least for me. But who knows, might get in a hurry to get it back together so I can DRIVE the thing.
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russosborne



Joined: 02 Jan 2011
Posts: 117
Location: Warren Ohio USA

1970 Lemans

PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2011 9:57 pm    Post subject: link to rolltissorie Reply with quote

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=44539&showall=1

yes, it is made out of wood. I can do that pretty well.

Russ
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Larry
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 14, 2011 11:02 am    Post subject: Rear Glass Area Reply with quote

Are you speaking of the metal between the rear window and the trunk area onthe outside? I believe those are reproduced.

Check Classic2Curret or perhaps Ames.

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russosborne



Joined: 02 Jan 2011
Posts: 117
Location: Warren Ohio USA

1970 Lemans

PostPosted: Fri Oct 14, 2011 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yep, that be it. I need to find out if the replacement is the whole piece, or just the top.

Didn't get much done last night, went out to eat with the wife when I got home.

Went out to the garage to look at something someone asked about, and couldn't stop myself from doing a little. Started on the headliner trim, and the windshield pillar pieces. Actually broke my phillips on one of the lower screws, neither one would budge, squirted some PB Blaster in on both sides, hope that loosens them up. The top screws came out no problem. So now I am worried about rust at the bottom of the pillars as well.
Also took the gaskets off along the roof on both sides, and one side of the metal that holds the gasket. Tend to forget all these little details that have to be done unless I am there looking at them. Embarassed

Have to work tomorrow, be at work by noon. That is 2.5 hours early for me, so doubt if I will do anything tonight. I usually get up around 12:30, work starts at 2:30pm weekdays. Don't normally go to bed until 4 or 5am.
But overtime is good, it is paying for the Lemans stuff. Very Happy

Russ
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